Barack Obama--Alan Keyes 1st Debate Online Broadcast

[Padrino]

7pm Tuesday (tomorrow) October 12, 2004

Ok, I'm sure anyone who checks this political forum remembers my thread introducing Obama as the Future 1st Black U.S. President after his very impressive keynote address at the DNC.

Well, this 1st debate for the Illinois U.S. Senate seat will be broadcast live online via radio streams available below, and all indications are that this debate will have a lot of extremely intense sparring between the 2 candidates known for their speaking abilities.

Barack Obama-Alan Keyes Debate Live Radio Stream!! (http://www.wjbc.com/xwjbc-webcasts.htm)

Keyes is hellbent (and many have said desperate) on trying to expose Obama as some radical left-wing extremist and narrow the incredible 45-50 point lead Obama currently holds in the polls.

Since Keyes entered the race in August as a GOP replacement, Keyes has thrown a long string of insults towards Obama in a very short time (it might be a record for Keyes). It should be noted that Obama has absolutely refused to engage in any negative campaigning against Keyes.

Keyes called Obama "a hard-line Marxist", and "basically a socialist" who "supports infanticide" while only "professing" to be a Christian.

Keyes called a news conference to tell reporters that Obama is "absolutely determined to make the world safe for criminals" because of his stance on gun control, but then Keyes spoke of how he approved of citizens carrying machine guns and of "the streets of Israel [where] you see every other person carrying arms and Uzis."

Keyes accused Obama of "taking the slaveholder's position" for supporting & voting in line with the current U.S. Supreme Court test on abortion regulation/prohibition.

Keyes said that "Jesus wouldn't vote for Obama" (apparently Keyes has a hotline to God).

After 3 weeks on insults when Obama joked in a rally that "he wanted to give his opponent a spanking b/c he epitomized all of the negative, scorched-earth politics seen in Washington", Keyes accused Obama of "using the language of the slavemaster" against him.

And then, most famously, at the Republican National Convention (Click for Hilarious Clip!) (http://wbbm.dayport.com/launcher/7178/?tf=video_player.tpl), Keyes allowed a Sirius radio interviewer to turn a conversation about Keyes' intense objection to gay marriage and extreme characterization of all homosexuals (not just ones who want to marry) as "selfish hedonists" (http://www.streamload.com/archpundit/signorilekeyes.mp3) into a conversation on his feelings about the behavior of the daughter of the Republican vice president of the United States.

Host: "So Mary Cheney is a selfish hedonist, is that it?"

Keyes: "Of course she is. That goes by definition. Of course she is."

Host: "I don't think Dick Cheney would like to hear that about his daughter."

Keyes: "He may or may not like to hear the truth, but it can be spoken."


And I wouldn't want to forget when Keyes also declared there is a "Smelly Toad" (http://www.streamload.com/archpundit/smellytoad.wmv) in Illinois politics.


So, yeah, their debate tomorrow should be damn entertaining. ;)

[Jason]

Right now I'm leaning towards Keyes but these Debates will have a greater effect on my vote than the Presidential Debates. Oh and the two debates after this one will be televised, at least here in Chicago.

[FastMotion]

I've actually seen them debate before somewhere, like on cspan or something.

Anyways, I thought Keyes won.
He's a very good debator who holds his Christian values to his core, I love that. :yes:

You can tell the man loves Jesus by what he says. He's very passionate. :cheeky:

[Jason]

Kyle are you voting in Michigan or Illinois?

[Padrino]

He's a very good debator who holds his Christian values to his core, I love that.....
You can tell the man loves Jesus by what he says. He's very passionate. :cheeky:People in the Ku Klux Klan also love Jesus and "hold their Christian values to their core", but I don't see much support for electing them to U.S. Senate seats. ;)

[silas]

People in the Ku Klux Klan also love Jesus and "hold their Christian values to their core", but I don't see much support for electing them to U.S. Senate seats. ;)

*inserts Robert Byrd joke*

[Brian]

Jesus Christ, after everything that crazy bastard has said how could you even remotely consider voting for Keyes?

[APlaneTookOff]

Keyes is hellbent (and many have said desperate) on trying to expose Obama as some radical left-wing extremist

fish in a barrel?

[Padrino]

*inserts Robert Byrd joke*West Virginia shouldn't even be a state. It's more like someone's backyard with chicken wire around it. ;)

[Padrino]

fish in a barrel?Hmmm.....all the polls don't seem to show he's been that convincing in his argument.

The Illinois Republican party doesn't even view Keyes favorably. In a recent poll, (http://www.rasmussenreports.com/Illinois_Senate_Fall%202004.htm) just 46% of Republicans plan to vote for their own party's nominee. 8% of Republicans say they will not cast a vote in the Senate race, while almost one in five Republicans are defecting to Obama (http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/sports/9708228.htm?1c).

Sixty-eight percent (68%) of Illinois voters have a favorable opinion of Barack Obama. Overall, 59% of Illinois voters have an unfavorable opinion of Keyes, including 39% who say they have a "very" unfavorable opinion of him.

Obama is close to setting a record for largest election percentage victory in U.S. Senate history.

[APlaneTookOff]

doesn't mean he's not another left wing nutjob.


*hint* - see the (D) by his name? ;)

[cokehead1138]

Daniel, remember when you shot that guy for breaking into your place? Well, Mr. Obama wants that dude that broke into said place to have the right to press charges against you.

[FastMotion]

People in the Ku Klux Klan also love Jesus and "hold their Christian values to their core", but I don't see much support for electing them to U.S. Senate seats. ;)

Yeah, but do they really love Jesus Padrino? Do they really hold their Christian values to their core? I think you know the answer.

Vote Keyes :yes:

[XHendrix24]

Since Keyes entered the race in August as a GOP replacement, Keyes has thrown a long string of insults towards Obama in a very short time (it might be a record for Keyes). It should be noted that Obama has absolutely refused to engage in any negative campaigning against Keyes.


If just for that one little thing alone, I hope that Obama wins. I can't even express how much it irks me when politicians almost base their campaigns around insulting the other candidate.

Newsflash Alan Keyes and most other politicians - When I take time listen to you campaign, I don't want to hear a speech about how you think that your opponent's a baby-eating anti-Christ. I want to hear about your policy. For a change.

:rolleyes:

[The Flicker Fade]

I'm quite comfortable with candidates who keep their Christian values at arm's length, thank you very much.


Or even in a locked lead box under their bed.

[Intoxicated Ricochet]

Isn't Keyes an out-of-state candidate? I abhor people who run for office in a state they probably have absolutely no familiarity with. Obama certainly has charisma, regardless of what party he's in and his performance thus far may indeed warrant him to hold office. I watched his key-note and was really struck by it. It surpassed Zell Miller just by its eloquence (although Miller did address a few legit points despite sounding like a ranting, raving lunatic).

NY has had a history of electing out-of-state flashy political celebrities (Hillary, Kennedy..). I wouldn't mind Giuliani, though. He wasn't that much of a "celebrity" before 9/11, he's lived in NY, and what he did for NYC is more noticeable than ever. Chuck Scheumer has mysteriously been running campaign ads during primetime here. I suspect he's getting paranoid about Rudy making a run for the Senate.

EDIT: Keyes said that "Jesus wouldn't vote for Obama"
Yeah, what a royal dick. This guy is a total tool.

[Dionysus55]

Jesus Christ, after everything that crazy bastard has said how could you even remotely consider voting for Keyes?
My thoughts exactly.

[Padrino]

Yeah, but do they really love Jesus Padrino? Do they really hold their Christian values to their core? I think you know the answer.

Vote Keyes :yes:Keyes is a stark raving lunatic. And he doesn't have a shot in hell at being elected for good reason. His campaign in Illinois (yes, IR, Keyes is from Maryland) has been the epitome of how not to run one. I think you would admit, Fastmotion, you haven't followed it even remotely closely.

Keyes is good at one thing....losing elections in embarassing fashion (this will be his 3rd defeat). Shit, he's almost perfected it. He goes down more dramatically than the Titantic.

It's gotten so bad and so frequent with all the crazy stuff Keyes has been saying that Obama's campaign manager makes sure to tell the media of each Keyes' speaking engagement so they don't miss any. Obama's campaign manager even drove the media to one of Keyes' press conferences when they didn't have a ride from a previous event.

I can't wait to listen to this in 10 minutes!

Make sure to listen/watch some of the clips I linked in my 1st post. Some are hilarious (smelly toad especially).

EDIT: Shit, it's not on until 7pm CST, not ET. Had it wrong by 1 hour.

[Jason]

Blake you know you won't be listening to this debate. You'll be watching the Red Sox kick the Yankees ass. :thup:

[Padrino]

I can listen for 30 minutes and hopefully catch the rest later on a blog or something. ;)

I know, it was all set perfectly before the game when I thought the debate started at 7pm EST, not CST. :D

[Padrino]

If just for that one little thing alone, I hope that Obama wins. I can't even express how much it irks me when politicians almost base their campaigns around insulting the other candidate.

Newsflash Alan Keyes and most other politicians - When I take time listen to you campaign, I don't want to hear a speech about how you think that your opponent's a baby-eating anti-Christ. I want to hear about your policy. For a change.

:rolleyes:A bit more on his opinion on that aspect in an article published today...


Democratic Senate Hopeful Denounces Negative Campaigns
Tuesday, October 12, 2004

By JODI HECKEL
© 2004 THE NEWS-GAZETTE
Published Online October 12, 2004

CHAMPAIGN - The "corrosive" effect of attack politics and "utter loss of civility" keeps politicians from talking about and solving problems effectively, said U.S. Senate candidate Barack Obama.

"You can lie about somebody. You can mischaracterize their position. You can go back on your word. You can spend all your time tearing somebody down instead of doing something positive," Obama said. "There is no other realm in our lives where that would be acceptable."

"It inhibits people from trying to introduce any complexity into the conversation, because as soon as they say anything complex, it will end up in a television ad or in a mail piece that makes them look like they're crazy."

The state senator and Democratic candidate for the Senate was speaking at the University of Illinois College of Law Monday afternoon. His speech was part of the Governor Jim Edgar Political Leaders Series, sponsored by the Institute of Government and Public Affairs in partnership with the law school.

His Republican opponent, Alan Keyes, has said Jesus Christ would not vote for Obama because of his positions on certain issues.

"Sometimes the statements made in this campaign are so outlandish, you've got to laugh," Obama said Monday.

"When I heard Jesus Christ wouldn't vote for me, I wanted to ask my opponent who his pollster was," Obama joked. "I wanted to connect with him, because there are so many more important questions. Am I going up or going down? There's the eternal life thing.

"People recognize this really is not helpful to us solving our problems," he added. "Really, what people want to hear is how we're going to solve these problems (of paying for retirement, college and health care and making the country safe.)"

Obama said his cool will be tested in his first debate with Keyes tonight in Springfield.

"I expect I'll have some fastballs thrown at my head," he said. "If I focus on the issues - jobs, health care, education - and correct some of the mischaracterizations Keyes is putting out there, I'll do just fine. I've been consistent in not running against somebody but running for something."

Former Gov. Edgar, who introduced Obama Monday, said he liked that style of campaigning and had a great deal of respect for Obama.

When asked about Keyes' campaigning style, Edgar said, "He has his ownstyle. It's different than what I would do."

"I was probably a lot more civil when I had a 30-point lead," he added."Alan Keyes doesn't have that luxury."

Edgar, a Republican, has not endorsed either candidate. He said he invited both of them to the lecture series.

"We have not heard from Ambassador Keyes," he said.

Obama told the law students, faculty and UI administrators Monday that citizens need to be more actively engaged in politics and problems need to be looked at from multiple angles - for example, poor school performance is a problem of both underfunded school systems and uninvolved parents, not one or the other.

Obama said he was suspicious of politics as a young man and thought student government was "corny." But he was inspired by the civil rights movement to become involved in social justice issues. The hope of improving things is what brought him to politics.

He repeated his message from the Democratic National Convention that Americans are connected as a people, no matter who they are or where they live.

"The idea that we've got these mutual obligations toward each other is central in making this country work," he said.

[Padrino]

And to take a look at an incredibly intelligent man who displays some very thoughtful foresight which is truly needed given the serious & complex nature of the problems and issues we face, check this out....

http://truthaboutkeyes.blogspot.com/2004/08/obamas-speech-prior-to-iraq-war.html


Obama's speech prior to the Iraq war
Of course, another example of someone who figured out that there wasn't a justification for the Iraq war before we ever went to war, is Barack Obama. From his website, is a LINK (http://www.obamaforillinois.com/index.asp?Type=B_PR&SEC={5CA3FD64-627D-4F7D-8264-4305CB8EF30A}&DE={5D342B62-154C-4FE6-910B-12B9C3CBB26A}) to the speech Obama gave on October 24, 2002. The best known quote is, obviously, this one:

"I am not opposed to all wars. I’m opposed to dumb wars."

On Hussein, Obama said:

"Now let me be clear – I suffer no illusions about Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal man. A ruthless man. A man who butchers his own people to secure his own power. He has repeatedly defied UN resolutions, thwarted UN inspection teams, developed chemical and biological weapons, and coveted nuclear capacity.

He’s a bad guy. The world, and the Iraqi people, would be better off without him.

But I also know that Saddam poses no imminent and direct threat to the United States, or to his neighbors, that the Iraqi economy is in shambles, that the Iraqi military a fraction of its former strength, and that in concert with the international community he can be contained until, in the way of all petty dictators, he falls away into the dustbin of history.

I know that even a successful war against Iraq will require a US occupation of undetermined length, at undetermined cost, with undetermined consequences.I know that an invasion of Iraq without a clear rationale and without strong international support will only fan the flames of the middle east, and encourage the worst, rather than best, impulses of the Arab world, and strengthen the recruitment arm of Al Queda."

If you've never read it, read the speech now. If you've read it before, read it again. It's that good.

[cokehead1138]

Back it up, asshole. Because I know it's just another gross distortion as usual.

Can you please stop sending me these fucking retarded ass comments you little fucking boyscout?

[The Flicker Fade]

Blake you know you won't be listening to this debate. You'll be watching the Red Sox kick the Yankees ass. :thup:

Funny, from where I'm sitting, the Bosox won't be able to sit down for a week. :cheeky:


I didn't catch the debate but I hope it was enjoyable.

[chago04]

Can you please stop sending me these fucking retarded ass comments you little fucking boyscout?
Add me to that list too. Blake, your pussy comments dont scare anyone.

[Padrino]

You two hardly ever back up your assertions with any credible proof (especially Arin). Furthermore, you two post on the board that I send you PM's pestering you?!?! Please.

I have never once initiated a PM to either of you. Not fucking once. Any and all of my PM's to you were replies to ranting PM's you two had sent me. And then you keep sending me PM's back until I tell you to stop or give it up. Both of you guys feel the need to PM me with little stupid comments, then twist it around on the board here.

I'll continue to give you both negative rep comments whenever you lie or make ludicrous & distorted accusations. Boo-fucking-hoo.

[cokehead1138]

Pulls a Padrino and does a little copy and paste.

Opposes Tougher Penalties for Criminals Who Use a Firearm Near a School

Refused to support legislation that would require adult prosecution for aggravated discharge of a firearm in or near a school. This legislation was proposed in the wake of the Columbine High School shootings.

Source: Senate Bill 759

Passed the Illinois State Senate (52-1-5) and Illinois House of Representatives and now is state law (PA 91-0015)

Supports Convicted Criminals Socializing with Gang Members

Opposed legislation that would have prohibited an individual who is sentenced to probation, conditional discharge or supervision for a criminal offense or who is released on bail to knowingly have direct or indirect contact with a street gang member.

Source: Senate Bill 1846

Passed the Illinois State Senate and Illinois House of Representatives and now is state law despite Obama's opposition. (PA 90-0795)
2004

Opposes Home Owners having the Right to Protect themselves against Intruders

Voted against someone protecting themselves with a handgun in their own home when during a home invasion.

Sources: Senate Bill 3, 2003
The Associated Press, September 13, 2004


Opposes the Death Penalty for Gang Members who Kill

Voted against making Gang Members eligible for the death penalty if they kill someone to help their gang.

Sources: House Bill 1812, 2001
The Associated Press, September 13, 2004

"There's a strong overlap between gang affiliation and young men of color," said Sen. Barack Obama (D-Chicago). "I think it's problematic for them to be singled out as more likely to receive the death penalty for carrying out certain acts than are others who do the same thing."

Source: Chicago Tribune, August 18, 2001


Opposed Toughening Illinois Law for Pedophiles and Rapists

Obama refused to support to toughen laws on pedophiles and rapists by revamping the Sexually Violent Persons Commitment Act.

Source: HB 2088 (2001)

This bill passed the Illinois State Senate (47-1-6) and Illinois House of Representatives and now is state law despite Obama's opposition. PA 92-0415

Opposes Toughening Laws for Drug Dealers who Target our Youth

In 2001, Obama refused to support legislation increasing the penalties for the delivery for Ecstasy and other designer drugs – often used by our youth.

Source: House Bill 126 (2001)

This bill passed the Illinois State Senate (51-1-3) and the Illinois House of Representatives and now is state law despite Obama’s refusal to support. (PA 92-0256)

Uses Race to Justify Support of Gangs

"There's a strong overlap between gang affiliation and young men of color," said Sen. Barack Obama (D-Chicago). "I think it's problematic for them to be singled out as more likely to receive the death penalty for carrying out certain acts than are others who do the same thing."

Source: Chicago Tribune, August 18, 2001
1999

Opposes Protecting Sex Abuse Victims Privacy

The only member of the Illinois State Senate to refused to support legislation that protects the privacy of a victim in a sex abuse case by allowing the victim to petition the court to have the trial records sealed.

House Bill 854, May 11, 1999

This legislation passed the Illinois State Senate(58-0-1) and the Illinois House of Representatives. Despite Obama's refusal to support this legislation, it is now Illinois state law. PA 91-0295
1997

Opposes Allowing Police Officers the Right to Protect themselves while on the Job

Opposed allowing an officer (when executing a search warrant) to enter a location without first knocking and announcing his or her office when there is reasonable belief that a weapon will be used against the officer or when there is imminent danger that evidence will be destroyed.

Source: House Bill 172 (1997)

This bill passed the Illinois State Senate (43-9-3) and Illinois House of Representatives and now is state law despite Obama's opposition. PA 90-0456

[cokehead1138]

Increasing Taxes on Illinois Business

Voted for $300 million worth of tax increases on Illinois businesses.

House Bill 848, 2004


Increasing Taxes on Working Families

Supported and voted for the “tire tax” – which provided a 50% increase in the fee that consumers pay for tires.

Senate Bill 361, May, 29,2003


Supported Government Raising Taxes without Notifying Working Families

Supported and voted to allow Cook County to increase property tax assessments without mailed notice.

House Bill 2378, May 9, 2001

Despite Obama’s support of this bill, it failed in committee.


Costing Working Families more at the Gas Pump

Opposed making the repeal of the state’s 5 percent gas sales tax permanent.

Senate Bill 1867, 2000


Raising Taxes on Illinois Consumers

Supported and voted for $80 million dollar liquor tax increase.

Senate Bill 1066, 1999

Raising Fees on the Backs of Working Families and Illinois Businesses

Supported and voted for 63% increase in fees for Illinois resident and businesses to register their vehicles.

Senate Bill 1028, May 21, 1999

Supported and voted for a 400% increase in fees for Illinois residents on vehicle titles.

Senate Bill 1028, May 21, 1999

Opposed Helping Illinois Families with their Education Costs

Opposed and voted against an income tax credit (maximum $500 per family) for education expenses such as tuition, book fee, and lab fees for all full-time K – 12 pupils.

Senate Bill 1075, March, 1999

This legislation passed the Illinois State Senate (35-21-1) and Illinois House of Representatives and despite Obama’s opposition this is now state law. PA 91-0009

Protecting Special Interests Dollars for Politicians

One of only 5 members to oppose and vote against legislation that would have eliminated special “tuition-free giveaway” scholarships at Illinois Universities given out by members of the Illinois House of Representatives.

House Bill 7, April 27, 1999

This legislation passed the Illinois State Senate (46-5-0), it failed in the House of Representatives.

Keeping Money out of Illinois Consumer’s Pockets

The only member of the Illinois State Senate to oppose and vote against a bill that would have lowered taxes on leased automobiles.

House Bill 402, May 12, 1999

This legislation passed the Illinois State Senate (57-1-0).



Supports Human Cloning

The only member of the Illinois State Senate to oppose and vote against legislation that would prohibit human cloning in certain circumstances.

Senate Bill 649: February 24, 2000

This legislation passed the Illinois State Senate (57-1-0).

Ok, this is fucking boring.

[Padrino]

Let me guess...."the truth about obama" site?


You fucking imbecile. You could do that with anyone's voting record charaterizing it like that. Sad thing is, the shit won't work with Obama b/c he is straightforward about everything and eloquently states his reasons for any vote he makes. And that is why he has almost 70% of the vote.


I hear sheep.

[cokehead1138]

You two hardly ever back up your assertions with any credible proof (especially Arin). Furthermore, you two post on the board that I send you PM's pestering you?!?! Please.

I have never once initiated a PM to either of you. Not fucking once. Any and all of my PM's to you were replies to ranting PM's you two had sent me. And then you keep sending me PM's back until I tell you to stop or give it up. Both of you guys feel the need to PM me with little stupid comments, then twist it around on the board here.

I'll continue to give you both negative rep comments whenever you lie or make ludicrous & distorted accusations. Boo-fucking-hoo.

Hey fucking asshole, you have pmd me countless time. You tell me to stop hiding and shit. Oh, did you ever think that maybe I left Internet alone for awhile? I know, impossible for you, but still. And Rep points are the same as pms. Ass.

[Padrino]

And Rep points are the same as pms.Ummm....no they're not. Anyone else want to chime in?

[cokehead1138]

Let me guess...."the truth about obama" site?


You fucking imbecile. You could do that with anyone's voting record charaterizing it like that. Sad thing is, the shit won't work with Obama b/c he is straightforward about everything and eloquently states his reasons for any vote he makes. And that is why he has almost 70% of the vote.


I hear sheep.

I said I copy and pasted you fucking school girl. Wtf is your problem? Do you live in Illinios? No. So fuck off.

[Padrino]

I said I copy and pasted you fucking school girl. Wtf is your problem? Do you live in Illinios? No. So fuck off.Where'd you copy and paste it from? The truth about obama site I imagine. Do I have to spell everything out for you?

Difference between you and I is, I put actual LINKS in my copy and pastes so people can see where I got it from and read it for themselves to judge its veracity & credibility.

[cokehead1138]

Where'd you copy and paste it from? The truth about obama site I imagine. Do I have to spell everything out for you?

Difference between you and I is, I put actual LINKS in my copy and pastes so people can see where I got it from and read it for themselves to judge its veracity & credibility.

Same difference. Wtf are you spelling out? How much of a fucking tosser you are?

[Padrino]

Same difference. Wtf are you spelling out? How much of a fucking tosser you are?How is it the same when you copy and paste characterizations of his votes, and that's what they are...someone's characterizations, but conveniently fail to mention where you copy and pasted it from?

The source of the characterization is important and relevant. You expect people just to take it as a truthful characterization at your say-so. I provide the opportunity for others to check out where I got the info from for themselves.

That's the difference between when I post something and when you do. And that's why you're a laughingstock to the overwhelming majority of regular posters here and I'm not.

[cokehead1138]

How is it the same when you copy and paste characterizations of his votes, and that's what they are...someone's characterizations, but conveniently fail to mention where you copy and pasted it from?

The source of the characterization is important and relevant. You expect people just to take it as a truthful characterization at your say-so. I provide the opportunity for others to check out where I got the info from for themselves.

That's the difference between when I post something and when you do. And that's why you're a laughingstock to the overwhelming majority of regular posters here and I'm not.

That's the thing. You CARE about what everyone thinks. Too bad I know that most people think you are a fucking ass. I think you are the only person to ever give me -reps. Not that I give a shit, but whatever.
:rolleyes:

[Brian]

And that's why you're a laughingstock to the overwhelming majority of regular posters here and I'm not.
The kid makes a good point here.

[Brian]

Too bad I know that most people think you are a fucking ass.
You would have score some points here if you'd have called him a fuck ass instead.

[elle]

I guess what I'm having trouble with is deciding who's dick is bigger.

:confused:

[gchild320]

I think Obama has them both beat. ;)

[APlaneTookOff]

What I am opposed to is the cynical attempt by Richard Perles and Paul Wolfowitz and other arm-chair, weekend warriors in this Administration to shove their own ideological agendas down our throats, irrespective of the costs in lives lost and in hardships borne.

Hahahaha, I'm sold. Finally, that speech sold me. Fuck Barack Obama, once and for all. Fuck. Him. Can't deal with people like him anymore.

He's a lunatic posing as some sort of "moderate", plain and simple. He believes in the silliest of things, from the Iraq war being fought for Israel, or for the company Halliburton, to the Patriot Act allowing for us to round up "innocent Muslims", like he said at the DNC. All that shit, he's pandering to people who believe in all that. Fuck him.

The only reason everyone's swallowing his lunatic Democratic talking point tripe is cause he's black, plain and simple. If he was white, nobody would have shit to say about him. F him. Can't deal with taht kinda stuff anymore :thdown:

[chago04]

Brilliant post! :thup: I listened to the debate, and was completely put off by how liberal his views are. Its a good thing that liberal senators do nothing (see John Kerry).

[Padrino]

Its a good thing that liberal senators do nothing (see John Kerry).I'll bet you $50 Kerry wins the election. Yes or no?

[chago04]

I'd say yes, but youd never give it to me when I win anyway. But this isnt about Kerry, this is about your little Obama fetish.

[Padrino]

I'd say yes, but youd never give it to me when I win anyway.Yes I would, I always pay up on my bets.

We can make an agreement that if the losing person doesn't pay up, they agree to be banned by Adam from the board until they do so.

And it's not like either of you offer any substantial coherent argument against Obama besides random "liberal" labeling and childish name calling.

So, yes or no about the bet? Scared?

Put your money where your mouth is.

[Padrino]

For anyone interested, here is an mp3 of tonight's Obama-Keyes debate (http://www.renewamerica.us/archives/speeches/audio/04_10_12keyes_obama_debate.mp3)...so everyone can listen to all of Obama's "crazy liberalism". ;)


Note: To Keyes' credit, he did come off well tonight, toned everything down, and didn't personally attack anyone.

[Brian]

I'd say yes, but youd never give it to me when I win anyway. But this isnt about Kerry, this is about your little Obama fetish.
I'm willing to enforce this and ban the loser until he pays the other, as Blake suggested.

[Padrino]

Chago,
I knew you'd be too scared to put your money where your blabbering mouth is.


EDIT: And I finally did initiate sending chago a PM today to get him to respond here. B/c we all know he's read the thread since his last post in it but won't respond.

[gchild320]

I really want to see this bet happen.

[APlaneTookOff]

Dude, take the bet. Do you have any idea what Kerry has to overcome to win this thing?

Jersey & New Hampshire are tied for f's sakes. What happens when Bush makes gains on states he didn't win in 2000, like oh say, Iowa, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, New Jersey, maybe Michigan? That's like 60 electoral votes. And let's not forget that John Kerry is not going to win a single southern state.

Matthews is gonna cry all the ink off his little dry erase board this year.

[APlaneTookOff]

:wet: I'm sorry I can't get over this:
"What I am opposed to is a dumb war." - Obama

He's opposed to 'dumb wars' fought at the behest of all those Jews in Washington. Now that's some brilliant statesmanship. :rolleyes: ;)

[Padrino]

Dude, take the bet. Do you have any idea what Kerry has to overcome to win this thing?I find it funny that I offered the $50 bet to you first tough guy, and you didn't want any piece of it. And now you're trying to be Apollo Creed rooting him on to go for it. Ha!

The $50 bet & it's newly added enforcement condition goes to the first of the Imbecile Trifecta (Arin, Logan, & Bob) to accept.

I'm waiting.

[APlaneTookOff]

Dude, I'm not betting someone over the internet I don't know on the friggen presidential election...



...and then taking his money
www.electoral-vote.com ;)

[Padrino]

Scared. And everyone can see it.

Think of how long you could hold it over my head here if you win the bet, let alone taking my money.

[APlaneTookOff]

Scared. And everyone can see it.

Think of how long you could hold it over my head here if you win the bet, let alone taking my money.

Hahaha! I already have enough to hold over your head. ;) I'm not scared. Are you going to *triple dog dare me* now, too? :D

Why don't you tell me how Kerry is going to pull this election off? Are Sway and P. Diddy and their 'dawgs' really going to get 20 million people to vote for him?

[Padrino]

Hahaha! I already have enough to hold over your head.Umm......like what, the Red Sox beating the Yanks? Oh wait, that doesn't happen in October.

If you're so confident Kerry won't win, bet me.

Otherwise, you're just embarassing yourself making up excuses and trite jokes trying to deflect the fact that you are not willing to put your money where your idiotic mouth is.


Why don't you tell me how Kerry is going to pull this election off? Are Sway and P. Diddy and their 'dawgs' really going to get 20 million people to vote for him?Well, seeing how in my battleground state of Pennsylvania, Kerry has now erased Bush's 4-5 point lead he had a few weeks ago to where Kerry is actually leading by a point or two.

That and the fact PA is bracing for a shattering record voter turnout of over 8 Million voters, based on the rampant new registrants etc., and the previous record for voter turnout in PA is 5.4 Million.

You tell me, given the voting/non-voting behavior tendencies/demographics we both know of, who do you think the overwhelming majority of the wave of newly registered PA voters are going to be voting for?

And they haven't even taken into consideration for the PA polls where Kerry has now taken a small lead.

Fact remains, I'm willing to put my money where my mouth is, you and Logan are not. And I think that doesn't come as any suprise to most of us regulars here.

[Intoxicated Ricochet]

I'm sorry but this bet thing is pathetic. Has everyone lost their minds?

[Padrino]

How is it pathetic?

I think it as a way to possibly contain the constant back and forth arguing between me and the Imbecile Trifecta that has reached an extreme level lately. If a person is so convinced of their position and persepctive of the election, they put up their money, shut up some, and wait to see what happens.

I will agree that I've been trying to bait Logan & Bob with further postings on the subject here b/c they continue to make excuses and that maybe it's getting old, but the idea of the bet is not pathetic IMO and several people here have contacted me in the past 12 hours to say they want to see it happen.

[chago04]

How is it pathetic?

I think it as a way to possibly contain the constant back and forth arguing between me and the Imbecile Trifecta that has reached an extreme level lately. If a person is so convinced of their position and persepctive of the election, they put up their money, shut up some, and wait to see what happens.

I will agree that I've been trying to bait Logan & Bob with further postings on the subject here b/c they continue to make excuses and that maybe it's getting old, but the idea of the bet is not pathetic IMO and several people here have contacted me in the past 12 hours to say they want to see it happen.
I've also gotten a lot of contact from people who think that the bet is a stupid thing. But why dont we step up the odds a little, alright? If bush wins, you 1) change your user title to Pro-Bush, 2) change your icon to Pro-Bush and change your signature to Pro-Bush for a period of no less than one month. I will do the same, except Pro-Kerry, should Kerry win. A friendly wager is way better, and more fun to watch, than a monetary wager anyday. If you insist on still betting money, go join a gamblers club where they teach you some odds. :p

[Padrino]

Now that's pathetic IMO. But I'll add those terms to the bet if you wish (winner picks the avatar & signature for the loser), but I want to bet money ($50) as the predominant thing. If there's no money involved, its really cheezy. Besides, there are so many ways for you to manipulate your terms by putting something else in your signature or usertitle disavowing the pro-Kerry thing if you lost.

If my odds are so bad, take advantage of what you think is my stupidity. I would think one of you three idiots would have the courage to bet me money. Oh wait, I forgot who I'm dealing with.

This is my last post on it b/c this back and forth is getting really old. Take the bet with $50 involved as part of it, or no bet.


I've also gotten a lot of contact from people who think that the bet is a stupid thing. Sure you have.

[APlaneTookOff]

Otherwise, you're just embarassing yourself making up excuses and trite jokes trying to deflect the fact that you are not willing to put your money where your idiotic mouth is.

You're right, I'm not. It's not a courage thing, it's an "I'm-not-going-to-bet-money-on-a-fucking-presidential-election" thing. I should though.

Bush 291, Kerry 229

[APlaneTookOff]

You tell me, given the voting/non-voting behavior tendencies/demographics we both know of, who do you think the overwhelming majority of the wave of newly registered PA voters are going to be voting for?

Kerry? Probably? Bush lost PA in 2000. It'll still be tight though.

Fact of the matter is, Kerry has made no gains in states that Bush won in 2000, with the exception of NV and maybe NH which is dead-even, while W is probably going to pick up three or four more states this time around.

[cokehead1138]

As if "message board betting" wasn't lame enough. :duh:

[Brian]

Ok guys...honestly, how can you call this lame just because we're on a message board?

Blake has offered a put up or shut up deal. I don't see how you can put it down without just not having the fucking balls to really invest in your strong opinion.

[blisstheabyss]

Why the hell would anyone bet cash over such a tight race? It's like the flip of a coin. Just because you love tails, doesn't mean you're gonna win. This election might be even closer than 2000.

Anyone who would bet $50 on this thing is an idiot. I'd rather see the Pro-Bush, Pro-Kerry thing. That would be funny.

[The Flicker Fade]

Why the hell would anyone bet cash over such a tight race? It's like the flip of a coin. Just because you love tails, doesn't mean you're gonna win. This election might be even closer than 2000.

Anyone who would bet $50 on this thing is an idiot. I'd rather see the Pro-Bush, Pro-Kerry thing. That would be funny.

Know what? I think we're onto something here. :lol:

If Kerry wins, I and any other members of the pro-Bush camp who wants in will change our avatars, signatures, and user titles to whatever the winning party wants for a period of one month. This can be anything Adam will allow- if he says so, even gay porn. And you can change it as many times as you want in that one month period.

If Kerry loses, you all have to do the same.

There is one condition, and that is at the bottom of the signature there must be, in size one font, bold and caps, this:

LOSER OF THE 2004 PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION BET



After all, it's a joke, and we want people to know it's a joke. We want it known they are being humiliated so it is much more funny. :D

Any questions?

So there it is, take it or leave it. Who wants in? :D


Not everyone has money, but this is funnier and more people can participate. Humiliation > Money.

[Raftysworld]

I'm in. (Pro-Kerry side). I'm completely broke, so I think this is a fair alternative. :p

[Dionysus55]

:lol: This thread is hella funny. And I think Art's way is best.

[The Flicker Fade]

I'm in. (Pro-Kerry side). I'm completely broke, so I think this is a fair alternative. :p

And we're on!

Brian, Blake, & Bob, I'm waiting on you. $50 is easy come & go but it takes a real man to walk around with a penis as an avatar and a user title of "Takes it in the Ass" for a whole month. :D

[silas]

And we're on!

Brian, Blake, & Bob, I'm waiting on you. $50 is easy come & go but it takes a real man to walk around with a penis as an avatar and a user title of "Takes it in the Ass" for a whole month. :D

I'm in. However, if anyone cares to make a monetary bet, I'll throw down $1000 saying you're wrong.

[Intoxicated Ricochet]

Count me in then. Monetary stuff is stupid but this sounds very promising.

[Brian]

Brian, Blake, & Bob, I'm waiting on you. $50 is easy come & go but it takes a real man to walk around with a penis as an avatar and a user title of "Takes it in the Ass" for a whole month. :D
Yeah, betting $50 was "lame" but this, this is a real legitimate bet.

;)

I wasn't the one who personally engaged in any bet invitations, so I'm pretty sure I'll pass.

[The Flicker Fade]

Yeah, betting $50 was "lame" but this, this is a real legitimate bet.

;)

I wasn't the one who personally engaged in any bet invitations, so I'm pretty sure I'll pass.

I never said it was lame, but this sure as hell is better. :cheeky:


I started another thread for it since no one's going to really dig through this one.

Will you be judge & enforcer?

[Brian]

I never said it was lame, but this sure as hell is better. :cheeky:


I started another thread for it since no one's going to really dig through this one.

Will you be judge & enforcer?
Sure thing. Just as I would have with the other bet.

I guess have whoever would like to be involved "sign" their name in that thread and what do you think is cool, like, some sort of ban if you fail to stick to it after you lose? If you're gonna agree to it voluntarilly there should be some consequences. I'd also suggest deciding exactly what the losing groups titles and avatars should be, and sticking to it, as it would be impossible to force everyone to keep changing them.

[silas]

Stop pming me, $1000 was a joke.

On topic, Alan Keyes is a very intelligent man, though I fear sometimes his temper gets in the way, making him appear, perhaps rightfully so, insane. On the other hand I do have quite a few problems with Obama, but honestly, i'm not from Illinois, and it's not my fight.

[Padrino]

Kerry? Probably? Bush lost PA in 2000. It'll still be tight though.

Fact of the matter is, Kerry has made no gains in states that Bush won in 2000, with the exception of NV and maybe NH which is dead-even, while W is probably going to pick up three or four more states this time around.
The point is that Pennsylvania represents one of the 8 "battleground" states that will decide the electoral college vote this year.

I can't wait for November 2nd for you to be dumbfounded at what happens when Kerry wins by albeit a small electoral college margin.

[APlaneTookOff]

The point is that Pennsylvania represents one of the 8 "battleground" states that will decide the electoral college vote this year.

I can't wait for November 2nd for you to be dumbfounded at what happens when Kerry wins by albeit a small electoral college margin.

haha, and my point was, there're what, 7 other battleground states. how many has Bush gained since 2000? how many does Kerry have to win to win in 2004? how many has Bush lost since 2000, more importantly?

I just wanna discuss the shit, not make stupid fucking bets about it. 2004 election d-i-s-c-u-s-s-i-o-n and all. :thup:

[Padrino]

haha....how many has Bush gained since 2000? Why don't you tell me how many Bush had definitely gained since 2000? I can't wait to read this...


how many does Kerry have to win to win in 2004? Hmmm...well, seeing how damn close the 2000 election & electoral vote was, the answer is "Not many more than 2000. At all."

If the entire election is mirrors 2000 save for one state, Kerry could win, depends on the state. Even if Bush takes a few small electoral states away from the Democratic side, if Kerry takes Ohio or Florida, it won't matter.


how many has Bush lost since 2000, more importantly? Again, not decided yet, but Ohio (20), Nevada (5), & New Mexico (5) went for Bush in 2000 and right now Kerry has a slight lead or has been substantially surging to a tie recently.

There are 8 battleground states as I said before. Whoever wins 5 of those 8 states will probably win the Electoral vote.

For anyone keeping score at home, here are the "8 to 10 Battleground States" that are statistical toss-ups at this point: (with the number of electoral votes in parentheses & how the state went in 2000 in brackets)

Ohio (20) [Bush]
New Mexico (5) [Bush]
Nevada (5) [Bush]
Florida (27) [Bush]
West Virginia (5) [Bush]
New Hampshire (4) [Bush]
Pennsylvania (21) [Gore]
Minnesota(10) [Gore]
Iowa (7) [Gore]
Wisconsin (10) [Gore]


I think Kerry will win Ohio primarily because of his debate performances & the unemployment crisis there, and those 20 electoral votes will go a long way.

But again, we shall see.

Oh, and sad to say, your figures from www.electoral-vote.com are highly suspect given the polls from those states I've been reading (the Ohio voting poll caption is hilarious). Another thing, it also tried to say NJ is a straight-tie. Haha!!

Believe whatever numbers you wish man, I can't wait for November 2nd, with the undoubted record voter turnout and what will become known as "the cellphone brigade" makes an unexpected influence in several close states.

All of these current polls completely fail to reflect any expectation of a higher turnout than usual among these younger voters. Pollsters have not come up with an effective means to conduct or even contact survey respondents who only use cell phones.

[Brian]

I think Kerry will win Ohio
God, I hope so.

[Padrino]

A very good analysis of the electoral college race from Meet the Press's Tim Russert.


MSNBC: The candidates need 270 electoral votes to become president of the United States. How’s the NBC Electoral College map stand and what do they need to do to win now?

Russert: We have George Bush ahead in 25 states, with 217 electoral votes. Sen. John Kerry ahead in 14 states and the District of Columbia for 200 electoral votes. How do they get that magical 270 number? This is the key: Florida, Ohio and Pennsylvania. If you win two of those three, you're on your way to the presidency.

If the president wins Florida and Ohio, which he did in 2000, that would give him 47 more — 264. He would need six. How does he get those? Either New Hampshire, Nevada or West Virginia, if he wins two of these three — all of which he won in 2000.

If John Kerry wins Ohio and Pennsylvania, that would give him 241. He then would need to go to Iowa, Oregon, Minnesota, Wisconsin and New Mexico. He'd have to win four of those five — all which Al Gore won — and he would have his 270.

But the key remains, Florida, Ohio and Pennsylvania. Whoever wins two of those three, I believe, will be the next president and that’s what this debate was all about.

[APlaneTookOff]

Why don't you tell me how many Bush had definitely gained since 2000? I can't wait to read this...

Umm, definitely? I'll have to tell you on November 3rd? We're going on predictions here, right?


Oh, and sad to say, your figures from www.electoral-vote.com are highly suspect given the polls from those states I've been reading (the Ohio voting poll caption is hilarious). Another thing, it also tried to say NJ is a straight-tie. Haha!!

Believe whatever numbers you wish man, I can't wait for November 2nd, with the undoubted record voter turnout and what will become known as "the cellphone brigade" makes an unexpected influence in several close states.

All of these current polls completely fail to reflect any expectation of a higher turnout than usual among these younger voters. Pollsters have not come up with an effective means to conduct or even contact survey respondents who only use cell phones.

Gee, great... where can I find the right numbers then?

Nader just got booted from the ballot in Pennsylvania. Looks like Kerry could have that state wrapped up.

[gchild320]

So is this bet going down or what? Official terms and names of who all is in.

[Padrino]

Umm, definitely? I'll have to tell you on November 3rd? We're going on predictions here, right?Come on, don't duck the question after you made the claim. Even though the election is not until November 2nd, there are states that are wrapped up for each candidate. Thus, a person can say some states are definitely on one side or the other. I'm just calling you out on your bravado.


Give me specifically the states you claimed Bush has gained since the 2000 election?


Nader just got booted from the ballot in Pennsylvania. Looks like Kerry could have that state wrapped up.Well, being from PA, that is part of what I am baseing my predictions on.

What is the current status of Nader on the ballot in Florida and Ohio? I know it's in serious limbo in both.

I just want to note, I agree with Joe Scarborough and think Bush will win Florida this year given the "4 Hurricane" effect. Hopefully, you know what I'm talking about so I don't have to explain. But if Nader is off the ticket in Florida, it could balance that out.

[The Flicker Fade]

I just want to note, I agree with Joe Scarborough and think Bush will win Florida this year given the "4 Hurricane" effect. Hopefully, you know what I'm talking about so I don't have to explain.

I don't, but it sounds interesting. :D

[APlaneTookOff]

Come on, don't duck the question after you made the claim. Even though the election is not until November 2nd, there are states that are wrapped up for each candidate. Thus, a person can say some states are definitely on one side or the other. I'm just calling you out on your bravado.

Give me specifically the states you claimed Bush has gained since the 2000 election?

New Mexico, Iowa, Wisconsin, I think.

I see your point though, they're not 'wrapped up' yet, and nobody can use the word definitely. And there're numerous polls, some of those could be tied, and apparently my source was bad. Yada yada yada. :thup:

Still, look at what Russert was saying --> Kerry'd have to take two out of those three, FL, OH, PA - and then four out of five, three of those being aforementioned NM, IA, WI. Kerry has an uphill battle.

[APlaneTookOff]

I don't, but it sounds interesting. :D

Bushitler got Jeb to build a weather machine so the old people would vote for Bushitler!

/DemUnderground

[Intoxicated Ricochet]

www.electionprojection.com only has Kerry some 10 electoral votes away from Bush. I'd say that's a huge leap from just over a week ago. I previously would have thought that the election would be clinched, but with the whole bunch of developments recently I think Kerry may be able to prevail, but I do agree he has an uphill fight on his hands.

[The Flicker Fade]

Kerry is definitely doing better than I had thought he would. Some of you may remember me saying Bush was going to win by a margin of the popular vote closer to 60% than 50% (55%+). I don't think that's going to happen anymore.

[TheNeoBez]

I just don't know how someone could respect some lunatic who supposedly holds christian values close to his heart. Infusing religion into your politics isn't a good thing for me, and I have to ask what kind of man would say such a retarded thing as "jesus wouldn't vote for obama". Sorry, Keyes is an idiot, IMO, and the the majority of Illinois would agree it seems. Obama's lead seems pretty much secure in his lead.

[Padrino]

Latest Classic Keyes Inflammatory Quote:

"Incest Becomes Inevitable with Gay and Lesbian Parents" (http://www.suntimes.com/output/elect/cst-nws-gay17.html)


U.S. Senate candidate Alan Keyes told a rally Saturday that incest was "inevitable" for children raised by gay couples because the children might not know both biological parents.

"If we do not know who the mother is, who the father is, without knowing all the brothers and sisters, incest becomes inevitable," Keyes told the Marquette Park rally held to oppose same-sex marriages.

"Whether they mean it or not, that is what will happen. If you are masked from your knowing your biological parents, you are in danger of encountering brothers and sisters you have no knowledge of."
And this is different from adoptive kids in other circumstances how?

It's not. Anyone who claims this guy is "brilliant," "smart," or an "intellectual," he or she needs to rethink that claim after such an asinine statement, unless of course, the good loon is going to denounce adoption and artificial insemination as well.


Parting Shot --Chicago Sun Times (http://www.suntimes.com/output/steinberg/cst-nws-stein18.html)

"But there is something about a recent misleading argument of his that is so false I find myself drawn in. I can't resist pointing out that Keyes' claim that incest is "inevitable" for the children of gays, because one of their parents might be unknown, is also an argument against all adoption, by straights as well as gays, since adopted children typically don't know their birth parents and thus might inadvertently shack up with a brother or sister after they grow up.

Keyes' claim is also a slur against children born to single mothers -- about a third of newborns, last time I checked. That Keyes would take this non-problem -- Inadvertent Incest: Menace to America! -- and use it to bludgeon gays and only gays illustrates the unfair, warped, punitive, bigoted and mistaken attitudes Keyes, and those who share his extremist notions, use to tar that group of Americans that so fascinates and frightens them."

[Padrino]

2nd Obama-Keyes Debate (TV Video links)
Thursday, October 21, 2004
Part 1 (http://abclocal.go.com/wls/news/video/102104_debate1.html)
Part 2 (http://abclocal.go.com/wls/news/video/102104_debate2.html)
Part 3 (http://abclocal.go.com/wls/news/video/102104_debate3.html)
Part 4 (http://abclocal.go.com/wls/news/video/102104_debate4.html)

[Intoxicated Ricochet]

I don't see how there could be any logic in voting for Keyes at this point.

[The Flicker Fade]

That is really really funny. Think maybe Keyes was told by "GOP" higher-ups to speak and act like a monkey so Bush doesn't seem so bad? ;)

[Padrino]

Ok, this is the final straw. Anyone who votes for Keyes is a complete moron. This Election Eve outburst (http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/specials/elections/chi-0411010203nov01,1,7115806.story?coll=chi-news-hed) puts me over the edge....

Keyes, who earlier told GOP leaders of his intention to make provocative campaign statements to get attention, ratcheted up the rhetoric further as he declared that there was no difference between Catholics who support Obama and Germans who voted for the Nazi Party.


"Any Roman Catholics who vote for Barack Obama are committing, in the opinion of the pope and the Holy See [Vatican City], a mortal sin," Keyes told reporters after a Crusaders Ministries service on the South Side. "He stands for the destruction of innocent life. He stands against the respect for the male-female family. On embryonic stem-cell research, on all the key issues of conscience, he stands for the position that has been identified by the Catholic Church as objectively evil.

"Catholics who vote for him make themselves part of that evil, just as the folks in Germany who voted for the party that eventually led to the Holocaust."

That is soooo far over the line, I wish I was next to Keyes so I could knock his teeth in. :angry: :angry:


And I'd like to point out an irony, that Keyes goes on and on constantly how homosexuality is an abomination, and that children's choices are a result of their parenting, and it just came out recently that Keyes' freaking 19 year old daughter is gay. You can't make this stuff up.

What soothes me is the fact Obama will very likely set the U.S. Senate record for largest margin of victory today with a 50 point landslide.

[APlaneTookOff]

Alan Keyes is black???!!

[The Flicker Fade]

It's a good thing there are SOOO many Catholics in Illinois. :rolleyes:


Think Keyes has effectively destroyed his entire political career already?

[Padrino]

It's hysterical that the self procliamed "greatest orator of the 21st century" has never won a single election. Shouldn't someone who constantly compares his political skill to Lincoln and Stephen Douglas at least be able to win some type of elected position? This will be his 4th huge defeat in 4 attempts.

[Jason]

Well I changed my mind before I voted today and I chose Obama instead of Keyes!

[cokehead1138]

Well I changed my mind before I voted today and I chose Obama instead of Keyes!

Fuck YEAH!!! Obama all the way!!! Fuck yeah to partial birth abortion!!! America...FUCK YEAH!!!

[APlaneTookOff]

yay, Baraka is the new senator.

[Padrino]

Barack Obama's "Thank You" Victory Speech.... :thup: :thup:


Note: Keyes refused to call Obama to concede or congratulate him, and insisted on speaking to the public 2nd after the results were in (the winner traditionally speaks 2nd). Shows what lack of class the man has.


"Thank you, Illinois. Let me begin by thanking all of the people who have been involved in this effort. From downstate to upstate, city, suburb, from every community throughout the state. Let me say how grateful I am to all of you for the extraordinary privilege of standing here this evening. Let me thank, because I will forget later on, it is a thankless task, let me thank the best political staff that there has been put together in this state. They are wonderful. You know who you are. You guys have been outstanding. I appreciate all of you. Let me thank my pastor Jeremiah A. Wright Jr. of Trinity United church of Christ. Fellow Trinitarians out there. Let me thank all the elected officials that stood by me through thick and thin. But most of all let me thank my family. I am so grateful to my nephew Avery, my niece Leslie, my mother-in-law Mary, my brother-in-law Craig Robinson. His wonderful girlfriend, Kelly. My sister Maya, my knew niece Suhaila right there, my brother-in-law Conrad. And most of all my two precious daughters Malia Obama and Sasha Obama. And the biggest star in the obama family until the two girls grow up. The love of my life, Michelle Obama, give it up to Michelle. Give it up!

Before I begin let me also thank the service of the person whose seat I'm going to be replacing. Peter Fitzgerald comes from another party, yet he served ably and with integrity and I’m grateful for his service and we shall applaud the service that he provided to us.

656 days ago I announced in a room a little smaller than this -- it was a lot smaller -- that I was announcing for the United States Senate. At the time, as many of you know, people were respectful but nevertheless skeptical. They knew the work we had done to provide health insurance to children who didn't have it, to help make the tax system more fair, to reform a death penalty system that was broken. But they felt that in a nation as divided as ours there was no possibility that someone who looked like me could ever aspire to United States senate. They felt that in a fearful nation like this someone named Barack Obama couldn't hope to win an election.

Yet here we stand because we had a different concept and notion of the American people. We understood that there was a core of decency to the American people. That there was a set of shared values that extended beyond race and region, extended beyond income and ethnicity. A belief that every child in America should have a decent shot at life. A belief that we are brothers and sisters. And that we have mutual obligations towards each other, and that those mutual obligations express themselves not only in our family, not only in our workplaces, not only in our places of worship, but also through our government. We believed in the possibility of a government that was just as decent as the American people are. And we knew that despite the misinformation, despite the bitterness, despite the partisan politics, that when you talk to people those common values would come out. That the innate instincts of the American people would surface, if we could speak to them, if we could connect to them, if we could talk to them directly.

And because of the efforts of so many of you in this room, we had the resources, we had the manpower, we had the capacity to touch each and every one of those hearts throughout the state.

And so as a consequence, I had a chance to hear the stories of people. And they would tell me we don’t expect our government to solve all our problems. We know that we have to teach all our own children initiative and self-respect and a sense of family and faith and community. But what we also know is that government can help provide us with the basic tools we need to live out the American dream. And we also know that we’re tired of politicians who are attacking each other instead of attacking problems. And that if we can come together as one people that we can make progress and close the gap between the ideal of America and its reality.

And today we stand here in the Land of Lincoln, the man who once called for us to appeal to the better angels of our nature, we stand here as testimony to that belief that Lincoln articulated: the possibilities of appealing to those better angels. We stand here as one people, as one nation, proclaiming ourselves to be one America with a capacity to work together to create a better future for each other. And what a magnificent gift that is to the nation. How wonderful it is that we have been able to accomplish this without negative ads and without the normal partisan politics and just focusing on the issues that matter to people: healthcare, and jobs and education.

And it is because of you that I have been able to do that. Because you created a protective garment over this campaign. Your spirit allowed us to run the kind of campaign that we’ve been able to run. We have had some good breaks in this campaign. There is no doubt about it. And I am under no illusion that we come out of this assuming that all people throughout the state of Illinois agree with me on every single position. But I think that what we’ve showed is that all of us can disagree without being disagreeable; that we can set aside the scorched-earth politics, the slash and burn politics of the past. We can consign that to the past. We can look forward to the future. We can build step by step to ensure that we arrive at the practical common sense solutions that all of us hope for. That's what this campaign has been about.

But we also have to remind ourselves that this is really just the end of the beginning. This is not the end itself. In the ultimate equation we will not be measured by the margin of our victory, but we will be measured by whether we are able to deliver concrete improvements to the lives of so many people all across the state who are struggling.

We will be measured by whether those men all across the state in Galesburg, in Rockford and Decatur and Alton, those folks who have been laid off their jobs, seen their jobs move to Mexico or China, lost their health care, their pensions threatened, whether they are able to find jobs that allow them to support a family and maintain their dignity. We are going to be measured by how well we deliver the resources to the school districts all across the state who are in deficit spending. To make sure that our children have the teachers and the programs they need to excel. We are going to be measured by whether or not we can provide access and affordability to healthcare so that no families in Illinois are bankrupt when they get sick. We are going to be measured by whether our senior citizens can retire with some dignity and some respect. We are going to be measured by the degree to which we can craft a foreign policy in which we are not simply feared in the world but we are also respected. That's what we are going to be measured by.

I told some of you about a story a couple of days ago where during a rally that the clergy had organized on the South Side of Chicago I was asked to meet with a woman who had attended a reception beforehand. And she was a woman who had voted absentee for me already and wanted to shake my hand and take a picture with me. And she came to the reception and she was very gracious and said how proud she was to have voted for me and how proud she was of the campaign that we had run. We shook hands, we hugged, we took a picture and all of this would be unexceptional except for the fact that she was born in 1899. Her name was Margaret Lewis. She may be watching television tonight. She’s 104. She will be 105 on November 24.......

[Padrino]

Continued....

"....And I have had much occasion over the last several days to think about Margaret Lewis. Trying to imagine what it would be like for this woman, an African American woman born in 1899, born in the shadow of slavery. Born in the midst of Jim Crow. Born before there were automobiles or roads to carry those automobiles. Born before there were airplanes in the sky, before telephones and televisions and cameras. Born before there were cell phones and the Internet. Imagining her life spanning three centuries, she lived to see World War I; she lived to see the Great Depression; she lived to see World War II; and she lived to see her brothers and uncles and nephews and cousins coming home and still sitting in the back of a bus.

She lived to see women get the right to vote. She lived to see F.D.R. drag this nation out of its own fear and establish the GI bill and social security and all the programs that we now take for granted. She saw unions rising up and she saw immigrant families coming from every direction making a better life for themselves in this nation.

And yet she still was held back by her status until finally she saw hope breaking through the horizon and the Civil Rights Movement. And women who were willing to walk instead of riding the bus after long day's work doing somebody else's laundry and looking after somebody else's children. And she saw young people of every race and every creed take a bus down to Mississippi and Alabama to register voters and some of them never coming back. And she saw four little girls die in a Sunday school and catalyze a nation. And then she saw the Civil Rights Act of 1964 passed and the Voting Rights Act of 1965 passed.

And she saw people lining up to vote for the first time and she was among those voters and she never forgot it. And she kept on voting each and every election, each and every election she kept voting thinking that there was a better future ahead despite her trials despite her tribulations, continually believing in this nation and its possibilities. Margaret Lewis believed. And she still believes at the age of 104 that her voice matters, that her life counts, that her story is sacred, just lake the story of every person in this room and the stories of their parents and grandparents, the legacy that we’ve established. The history of so many people building calloused hand, by calloused hand, brick by brick a better future for our children.

That's what America understands that we don't just inherit the world from our parents, but we also borrow it from our children. And that is why tonight; as we stand here we have to understand that we have another join ahead and it is going to be a journey even more challenging than the one we have already embarked on. There are people today right now who are as skeptical about the future as they were at the outset of this campaign. There are people who are saying that the country is too divided, that the special interests are too entrenched. That there is no possibility that one person in the senate can ever make a difference, they don't believe that we can provide affordable healthcare to families across the state of Illinois. They are not convinced we can provide economic development for rural communities that have been forgotten. They don't really ascribe to the notion that in this competitive global economy we can still assure that every person gets a living wage. They are skeptical of the possibilities that our children can enjoy a better future than we had.

And for those skeptics who believe that we can accomplish what we set out to accomplish, if our minds are clear and our heart is pure and we believe in a just and merciful God, I say to them look at this crowd tonight, look at this election today, and I have three words for them.

The same three words that we started the campaign, the same three words that we finished the primary, the same three words that are going to carry us, because as Dr. King said, "The arc of the moral universe is long but it bends toward justice as long as we help bend it that way."

I have three words for them. What are those words? Yes, we can. Thank you Illinois and I love you. Thank you. Thank you Illinois."

[APlaneTookOff]

yay, Baraka is the new senator.

From user CP:


Don't fucking comment if you don't the thread. And at least show the respect by spelling his name correctly.

Padrino is a little girl.

[Padrino]

And you're an asshole. At least we have that situated.

[blisstheabyss]

who's ready to cash in on our bet? ;)

[APlaneTookOff]

And you're an asshole. At least we have that situated.

:bigcry: :bigcry: :bigcry: